GPU ROPs Differences Between PS4 & Xbox One Don’t Reflect Practical Scenarios, eSRAM Still A Factor

Wolfgang Engel talks about a recent GDC presentation that analyzed ROP utilization for the next gen consoles.

Posted By | On 08th, Jun. 2014 Under News


PS4 Xbox one

At this year’s Game Developers Conference, Avalanche Studios head of research Emil Persson offered his views on the PS4 and Xbox One effectively utilizing ROPs for higher bandwidth textures. According to Persson, the PS4 could render 64 bit textures while the Xbox One could only handle 32 bit textures before it ran out of bandwidth.

GamingBolt spoke to Confetti FX founder Wolfgang Engel, who provides consulting and tech solutions to different developers besides having handled Rockstar’s RAGE technology for GTA IV in the past, about providing the same level 64 bit performance on the Xbox One.

On Persson’s figures, Engel stated, “Those are highly theoretical numbers because they don’t reflect a typical game scenario. In the game you start rendering into shadow maps which eats up memory bandwidth, then you start rendering into G-buffer for deferred lighting and then you render it into a reflection map which might be a cubed map, then you start rendering lights in a light buffer, followed by a post effects pipelines render which might require a lot of memory copies, depending on how you implement it.”

Engel also stated that the inclusion of Xbox One’s eSRAM can potentially change the figures as well since it has a high bandwidth of 204 Gb/s. “Let us take a scenario where you have 20 different render targets per frame and you render them into memory, it will be hard to say this will be faster than this one and it’s even hard to make a general assumption about something, especially with the eSRAM in the mix. It highly depends on how you use system memory and eSRAM. You will run a lot of performance captures to see what the bottleneck is, memory access or arithmetic instructions. In most cases I predict memory access patterns will be your biggest challenge.”

As we highlighted in one of recent articles, memory access patterns will play a massive role in games development. Having different paths for the CPU and GPU  to access the memory can result into big wins in the performance area. We will have an article sometime after E3 that will focus on memory access patterns.

In the meantime do you have any thoughts? Let us know below in the comments section below.


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  • Guest

    So the Avalanche dev is saying that the PS4 render 64bit textures whereas the X1 cant and has to stick to 32bit texture renders in order to avoid running out of bandwidth and then thiis Engel guy is saying, not so fast. It really starting to seem like these Engel guy thinks the X1 is a better machine. Which is just ridiculous. Because seriously, one machine has 176GB/s of bandwidth over 8 GB of RAM while the other has 68GB/s over 8GB of RAM and 204GB/s to 32MB of RAM. And lets not forget, in order to achieve 204GB on the eSRAM, it has to be doing both reading and writing accesses. Otherwise, its half that. And the truth is you are not going to be doing simultaneous reads and write at the same time often. So based on just those specs alone, i am far more inclined to go with the Avalanche guy than this Engel guy, which seems to be to pro X1. Also, to disregard the 32ROPS vs 16ROPS, especially since they help with resolution and rendering in general. 32MB is just to small of a amount to be used effectively.

    • If you look at both their credentials and history of products shipped, Engel is the one with the more qualified background…

    • Michael Norris

      Yes but he also does not know where gaming is going.Ps4 is set up for HuMa.This feature will be used for first party games and at some point 3rd party.MS should have added another 32mb Esram to make things easier for developers.

    • If I remember what I’ve read correctly, both PS4 and XB1 have unified memory architectures so you’re wrong on that count. XB1 chose to have a faster CPU instead of GDDR5 b/c of the bandwidth capabilities of the CPU. Both boxes CPU’s can’t take advantage of the GDDR5’s speed but the GPU can – that’s the only area where PS4 has a sizeable advantage in addition to the extra GPU cores.
      Second, and I’m not the most fluent in describing this but from what I’ve read, the ESRAM is presently used by developers as the main conduit to the GPU when it should be used in heavier areas in the render pipeline which require faster access to the processor/GPU…

    • xoj_21

      no they slightly clock it higher because temperature let it.

      those cpu can get up 2ghz..
      and for PR lookw e have 2ghz, we are better ps4 1.6ghz.

      but games are telling other wise.

      also the ps4 have 32 rops, very important to push pixels..

    • Temperature? The only thing about temperature on the XB1 is the bigger box to prevent another red ring of death. You need to research your statements more. Here, try this. You might learn something: http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/digitalfoundry-the-complete-xbox-one-interview

    • Guest

      Says the guy that knows nothing!

    • I’m curious, is your sense of self respect that dependent on you believing the PS4 is that much better than the XB1? It sure seems like it, posting from an anonymous account without any other sources to backup your claims.

    • Guest

      Is your? Cuz you certainly are the one that thinks like that. Proven by that very statement. And i dont have anything to back it up? Reality muthaf-er, the fact that the PS4 has been beating the X1’s bottom since it came out. Hwat do you have? Hopes, and dreams, and wants? I dont even own a PS4 you muppet, but that doesnt mean i cant know the fact. He’s talking about a hypothetical scenario whereas Emil Persson is talking facts. And my account is no more anonymous than yours is, Jeremy Locanas, if that even is your real name. My get off my you know what and go back to MS’s

    • Keep talking sugar mouth. The fact that you’re so angry demonstrates your lack of intelligence and finesse. The competition between both consoles are far from over.

    • Guest

      Im angry at your stupidity. And whats your stupidity demonstrate? You wpouldnt know what intellignece and finesse is if it bit you in the you know what. And dont act like you’re not mad. If you didnt care then you wouldnt be responding to eac and every single one of my comments. So its getting to you to, smart guy.

    • Wrong, I’m not mad, I’m just enjoying pushing your buttons watching you berate everyone who disagrees with you on this page, lol. Unlike you, I know I’m smarter than you and my level of intelligence isn’t based on supporting a video game platform. Would it surprise you to know I owned a PS3 too? Probably not, you’re so much of a rabid Sony fanboy it’s funny watching you angrily attack everyone on here…

    • Guest

      Wow, you really are stupid, LOL! you actually think you’re smart when all you’ve done ois said, stupid nonsense after stupid nonsense. And you know that i dont own a Sony system, never have and actually own a 360. You just keep making a fool of yourself. And you’re obviously nothing more than a loser who gets his jollies of supposedly messing with people on the internet. Arent you cool. Loser! And p.s. im not even mad, im actually laughing everytime you post.

    • And yet you just said you were angry two posts ago. You’re so stupid you don’t even know how you’re feeling.

    • corvusmd

      Hey Jeremy I just read this whole convo…and I have to say I’m sorry and I feel your pain. You try to lay out an intelligent argument using facts and all you get in return is “na uh, you’re stupid”. The problem is you aren’t arguing with gamers, you’re arguing with fanboys, they have already made up their mind and aren’t interested in facts or logical arguments…just jumping on the bandwagon. I also love how they tried to prove you “wrong” about things you weren’t arguing…that tactic is always great…kill credibility by making up the other persons’ argument. None of these kids are Devs, don’t sweat it, they are just hopefuls.

    • melrex

      Your right you can’t talk intelligent with fanboys

    • melrex

      Lol your right

    • Guest

      Ok, you’ve just proven that you do not know anything about what youre talking about. Talk about stupid. MS speed up their CPU as a reaction to the PS4 being more powerful and the PS4’s CPU still outperforms it. Hence why is output 14MB/s in the Substance engine while the X1 (running at a higher clock speed) puts out less at 12MB/s. Also, the X1 is not a hUMA architecture whereas the PS4 is. The GPU has more performance advantages than just the CU cores. And the esram is there to compensate for the slower DDR3 main RAM, becuase MS was to cheap to pay for the higher bandwidth GDDR5.

    • You’re wrong. XB1 has unified memory architecture. Here: http://www.videogamer.com/news/xbox_one_has_implementation_of_huma_memory_system_just_like_ps4_say_dev.html

      The ESRAM isn’t a compensation piece, it’s an evolution of the EDRAM architecture in the 360 which provided plenty of great graphics and more sales volumes on the 360 than the PS3 despite it having a more powerful Cell processor.

    • Guest

      Ok, seriously, you really know nothing. Its not a evolution of EDRAM, its been around for a long time and MS themselves said that its in there to compensate for the slower DDR3 RAM. Then they later started changing their tune once they ssaw how people reacted to it in comparison to the PS4. Hence since theyve been on a crusade of PR to try and fool, idiots like you who believe it. And the PS3 sold more than the 360, get your facts right. In your world 2+2 equals 5

    • You’re the one who’s wrong. Here, read this: http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/digitalfoundry-the-complete-xbox-one-interview

      You really need to do your research sugar mouth. Look up total sales revenue of XB360 titles versus PS3 titles and see who has made more money overall. Sony has been posting nothing but losses the last few years and is bordering on bankruptcy. Microsoft has established superior franchises to PS4 based on numbers of copies sold. That’s a fact. I believe they’ll do the same this generation with really great software.

    • Guest

      Oh nice, change the goal post, how expected of a ms fanboy, first you claimed that the 360 had sold more than the ps3, then when you realized thats not true, you change it to games. But you do realize that PS4 is selling more software than the X1 right? You’re pathetic and you’re also hopeless, and what in the DF article am i supposed to see? Cuz i kow im right.

    • No one changed the goal post. You said the ESRAM architecture wasn’t an evolution of EDRAM in the 360. If you were smart enough to read and understand the interview with the XBox Chief Engineers they clearly state the ESRAM is an evolution of the Xbox 360 architecture, but you’re not entirely smart enough to understand what they’re saying are you? Actually, I bet it’s more like you can’t read since you keep misstating things and thinking fiction is fact. I will give you one thing, PS4 has sold more units than XB1 for now, no one’s disputing that, but like I also said this console generation is far from over. PS2 was a crappy system that went on to win its generation. XB360 was a less powerful system compared to PS3’s cell but it still sold more software and I’m sure XB1 will do just fine when it’s all said and done and we have another next-generation of consoles at our doorsteps.

    • Guest

      Ok, explain to me how its an evolution, when its the same thing as the 360. Actually its a step backwards, cuz at least the 360s main ram (gddr3) was fast enough/had enough bandwidth to render at 720p making the edram a addition to the bandwidth, whereas the X1’s ddr3 ram isnt fast enough to render most games at 1080p and instead has to rely on a measely 32mb of higher bandwidth ram to compensate for its deficient main ram. And i’ve never own a Sony system and had the Xbox original, because i thought the ps3 was underpowered, but the ps2, had way better games, hence why it went on to blow everybody away in sales. Now seriously kid, youre obvious a halfwit and im am really growing tired of this. I got better things to do then to keep playing games with an imbecile like you. Cuz they said, lol, you ever hear of a thing call PR? Look it up. You got a long way to go in life kid.

    • You’re such a piece of work – read the article and you’ll find the answers to all your “questions”. But I’m still assuming you’re not smart enough to understand the details or you can’t read since you keep spouting nonsense…

    • Dionm

      Heh you missed out on TLOU then on PS3 – get a PS4 and get it REMASTERED NOW!

    • AndrewLB

      Sony took a loss on almost every PS3 they sold, and I believe it finally became profitable in late 2012. 360’s were sold at a loss as well but a much smaller one, and the hardware became profitable much sooner.

      Regardless, the money is in the games, and it’s clear that FAR more 360 games were sold than PS3 games.

    • Guest

      So a 10.97 tie in ratio is so much more than a 10.01 tie in ratio? So on average PS3 owners bought 10 games whereas 360 owners both almost 11. Wow! that is so much more! Stupid fanboy, just parroting back the other stupid nonsense the other stupid fanboys say. Clown!

    • Dionm

      I’d argue that since the CPU is the same Jaguar Processors the Xbone is actually slightly faster (not that it matters anyway when its the GPGPU’s that matter this gen – CPUs can be stuffed 😉 )

    • Guest

      So now you’re saying that Engel knows more than Emil Persson? You’re crazy. Fact, the PS4 is more powerful than the X1 and it shows and no amount of bull being given to you by this guy will change that. He is simply talking about one scenario that isnt that common to try and argue that the esram isnt a bottleneck, when it clearly is.

    • Learn to read, no one said the PS4 wasn’t a more powerful box than the XB1 the discussion was whether the XB1 could perform better at 1080p resolution?

    • Guest

      The X1 cannot “perform” better at 1080p. Learn to learn

    • What are you talking about? Let’s see – Forza 1 and 2, 1080p. Wolfenstein: TNO 1080p. Quantum Break 1080p. Halo 5 and Gears of War 4, I’m assuming will be 1080p also. Why don’t you wait until the post 1st year exclusive games -which really utilize the hardware- come out before spouting out all this nonsense.

    • Guest

      Forza 1 and 2 run at 720p, kid, get your facts right. And where is it said that Qb runs at 1080p? And yes, you are assuming on everything else. And why dont you just stop spouting nonsense, period. And p.s. you make no sense, you didnt say that X1 cant run at 1080p you said that they perform better at 1080p which is just ridiculous, just like everyone of your statements.

    • You need to stop lying. You may think you’re all smart by saying anything just to create controversy but it really just proves how unintelligent you are. Here’s further proof of you being wrong AGAIN like I’ve been posting via articles all afternoon demonstrating your statements are incorrect.

      Forza 1 resolution: http://www.computerandvideogames.com/411067/forza-5-to-run-at-60fps-in-1080p-resolution/

      Forza 2 resolution: http://www.gamespot.com/articles/xbox-one-s-forza-horizon-2-is-1080p-30fps/1100-6420120/

      QB: http://news.xbox.com/2014/05/games-quantum-break-teaser

      Wolfenstein resolution: http://www.ign.com/articles/2014/02/27/wolfenstein-the-new-order-is-1080p-60fps-on-xbox-one-and-ps4

    • Guest

      Hey moron, look at what you wrote “Forza 1 and Forza 2 running at 1080p”. And when you figure out what the problem is there then you can call other people “unintelligent” (im surprised you can even spell the word). Til then buzz off, and get off my you know what. And Wolfenstein on X1 drops to 960x1080p, oh you know that res you fanboys clowns said isnt 1080p. Look at it up, right there on the 3rd paragraph. its drops lower than the PS4 version and its drop res way more often.

      http://www.eurogamer.net/artic

    • Dude, if you’re too stupid to understand shorthand for Forza Five (1st on XB1) and Horizons (2nd on XB1) you really need help. As for the link you pasted, it doesn’t work – like everything you’ve said all afternoon.

    • Guest

      I knew what you was saying but you was to stupid to use a 5 instead of a 1. Like i said, 2+2 equals 5 to you. Later smart guy. Stop responding back to me, get off my snicker.

    • You’re such a piece of work, lol. Keep on spreading lies dude, it’s what you’re good at. No wonder you keep your handle as Guest, that way you can keep on spreading lies and no one will know who you really are.

    • Dionm

      To be fair though you always refer to the number IE Forza 1 being the first in the series, and besides there are titles that aren’t named 1,2,3 etc like Forza Horizon.
      I personally have a pet peeve with saying Fable “1” or Forza “1” – its JUST FABLE or FORZA… those games when they came out NEVER had a one affixed to the title. – Sure you might say “what if you talked about the Fable series then you couldn’t just call the first “fable” but rather Fable 1.” I’d reply stating that you would just mention series along with the title. IE So the fable series spans three games… from Fable to Fable 3 … (you get the drift)
      Similar to how I found it stupid that people could possibly get confused with Xbox and Xbox One.

    • AndrewLB

      Game resolution does not “drop” to a lower resolution while you’re playing a game .

    • TETASHMM

      I feel sorry for you, you obivioulsy fall for a 3rd time to M$ ugly charm and bought for 500 DOLLARs a weaker console… believe me = without that paritiy “requirement”… the difference would be visible, more than just having better shadows, HBAO, texture and what not (Watch Dogs).

      I´m no expert Jeremias, but based on the specs :

      PS4 has 100% more ROP (important for Reso. AA? and such)
      PS4 has 50% more Shaders (again AA, Reso)
      PS4 has 1x Pool of Memory of 8Gb GDDR5 at 180Gb/s at peak

      XB1 has 2x Pools of Memory, 1x slooooow 8Gb at 65gb and 1x 32vram” at 102 or 204Gb. If this console would be sooo powerful, Forza 5 would not have been severly downgraded, don´t you think?

      I´m not saying you should not buy fugly, shitty XB1… im just trying to say to people like you to wait until it´s muuuch cheaper > then pick one up. By the time the console falls below 200$ > the same shaite will start over again > pirates takeing over control…

      Im Sony Biased, but dont own a PS4 yet.. and maybe never will (too expensive games), XB1 will struggle a lot for 1080p content with some type of Anti Aliasing. It will be more a 900p experience or 720p thru the XB1 life cycle, unless they downgrade the games… 32mb aint enough for 1080p + AA (even for FXAA might be too small)

    • testa

      I´m no expert Jeremias, but based on the specs :

      PS4 has 100% more ROP (important for Reso. AA? and such)
      PS4 has 50% more Shaders (again AA, Reso)
      PS4 has 1x Pool of Memory of 8Gb GDDR5 at 180Gb/s at peak

      XB1 has 2x Pools of Memory, 1x slooooow 8Gb at 65gb and 1x 32vram” at 102 or 204Gb. If this console would be sooo powerful, Forza 5 would not have been severly downgraded, don´t you think?

      I´m not saying you should not buy fugly, shitty XB1… im just trying to say to people like you to wait until it´s muuuch cheaper > then pick one up. By the time the console falls below 200$ > the same shaite will start over again > pirates takeing over control…

      Im Sony Biased, but dont own a PS4 yet.. and maybe never will (too expensive games), XB1 will struggle a lot for 1080p content with some type of Anti Aliasing. It will be more a 900p experience or 720p thru the XB1 life cycle, unless they downgrade the games… 32mb aint enough for 1080p + AA (even for FXAA might be too small)

    • Edonus

      You are just parroting the same mis information that has been on the internet for the last half a year. You are doing the typical mis information shuffle. First you try to down play, deny, hide the fact that the X1 has a higher bandwidth.
      I have been saying for the longest we dont know how the resources in these systems are allocated. We dont know how they will perform with engines created to utilize their new structures. Several devs and engineers have already gone on record explaining how proper eSram usage will garner great results.
      I personally feel MS set out to make the X1 with specific goals in mind for the generation so they made a complex system to reach those goals. It may take some prodding and poking but everything they need is there.
      I think Sony on the other hand didnt have as focused of an idea as MS so they just looked at consoles and games how they are made today and multiplied the parts. Thats why it was so easy to port over last gen games. Look at whats happening as we get further into the cycle and start dealing with games that are more heavily designed for the new gen consoles.

      I think that the Ps4 power talk has been pre mature and is just a reflection of bad journalism.

    • Knee-Grow-Please

      LOLOLOLOLOL

    • Guest

      Are you crazy or just stupid? Which is it? Im parroting misinformation? You’re the one parroting misinformation! The X1 does not, have higher bandwidth than the PS4, you think that a puny 32MB’s of eSRAM is going to somehow even out the bandwidth playfield? You’re both delusional and dumb if you do. If the X1 had higher BW than the PS4 then why does COD and MGS have a 125% lower res on the X1 along with BF4, AC4, Metro Redux, Shadow Warrior, Trials Fusion, PvZ, Witcher 3, Thief, TR, and Wolfenstein which all have resolutions lower by anywhere between 56% to 44%? And you do know that res and bandwidth are closely tied together right? I mean thats basic knowledge. Im sorry to break it to you but the PS4 is a good clip more powerful than the X1 and no DX12, or cloud, or TR or whatever other secret sauce you fools come up with.

    • corvusmd

      Please stop, you are trying way too hard and only showing you have no idea what you’re talking about. It’s really embarrassing actually. I feel bad. PS4 has more powerful hardware, but in the end result when it gets to the screen…the differences are SOOOO minor that you’ve spent more time being aggressive on this board than anyone would ever be concerned about graphics on their X1 this entire gen. Please stop blowing it WAY out of proportion. No one really cares HOW we get to the finish line if it’s a tie.

    • Guest

      Most console gamers would disagree with you going by sales.

    • Michael Norris

      Yea the 204GB figure is MS math,what xbot’s don’t understand is when you have a major bottleneck aka ”32mb” Esram that hinders the whole console to a point.Like you said you have one console that has 178GB/s of bandwidth while the other has 68GB/s and ”204GB/s read and write”,The Ps4 is an easier platform to develop for and has a beefier Gpu/memory setup.I found it funny that Engel dismissed the RoP difference,it’s not like these two console’s are much different from one another.

    • Guest

      The more he speaks the more he starting to sound like a pro MS guy. He’s gonna dismiss a 100% ROP increase in the PS4 but then come up with some hypothetical scenario on the X1 to try and argue for the benefits of esram. When reality is already showing/proving that its a bandwidth bottleneck. Period!

    • Why don’t we wait for the exclusives to demonstrate what each console is capable of before you whining about what is or isn’t true. First set of console games for any generation usually are just warm ups anyway. That’s a historical fact.

    • Guest

      I give up, im done with you, later captain obvious.

    • Bye sugar mouth. It’s been fun.

    • Guest

      Bye sugar mouth. It’s been fun (wow, i felt etarded saying it)

    • Hey moron, learn how to spell retarded. Oh wait, forgot you can’t read so you can’t spell either.

    • corvusmd

      You’re right dude, we should tell Mr Engel to quit his job because “Guest” on gamingbolt said “na uh”

    • Daniel Lawson

      the ESRAM can R/W to either CPU or system RAM so it’ll ALWAYS be reading and writing

    • Guest

      Xbox’s CPU has no direct access to the ESRAM.

    • Edonus

      I think that what the data move engines are for. they can access all parts of the system and move data really fast around the system.

    • Guest

      No, the DMA registers help move data between DDR3 and ESRAM. That’s not necessary on PS4 since it has fully unified GDDR5 RAM.

    • Daniel Lawson

      you’re right… that was my bad

    • Jorge Almeida

      176 Gb/s on PS4 is for both reading and writing to but yes ps4 is still more powerfull due to other factors

    • Failz

      Oh look what we have here? A kid that thinks his a professional. Keep trying to justify your purchase because no one here really gives a $h1t.

  • Illusive Man

    Based on the previous Avalanche article it looks like the Xbox One only
    becomes ROP bound if the developer is using the DDR3 exclusively, at
    RGBA8 – 853 MHz * 16 * 4 bytes which equals to 54 GB/s. The PS4 on the
    other hand becomes ROP bound at RGBA8 – 800 MHz * 32 * 4 bytes which
    equals to 102GB/s. Using RGA16F the PS4 is bandwidth bound at 204 GB/s
    (800MHz * 32 * 8 bytes).

    However, things change a bit into
    the Xbox One’s favor in terms of matching the PS4 when the ESRAM is
    factored in. Using RBA16F format that Xbox One becomes bandwidth and ROP
    bound at 109GB/s (853Mhz * 16 * 8 bytes). But when the Xbox One uses a
    RGBA32F format the Xbox One becomes bandwidth bound at 218 GB/s (853Mhz *
    16 * 16 bytes).

    http://www.dsogaming.com/ne

    Also remember on PS4 it has two separate memory buses. Onion is mapped
    through the CPU and is capped at 20 GB/s. The Garlic bus is mapped
    through the GPU and can utilize the full bandwidth of 176 GB/s. The CPU
    on Xbox One on the other hand can utilize the full bandwidth of the DDR3
    pool which is bandwidth bound at 54 GB/s. GPU can all access the DDR3
    and the ESRAM. Depending on how the ESRAM is managed it could have a
    comparable effective memory bandwidth to the PS4. The Avalanche article
    also proves that in terms of ROPs the ESRAM could also create a
    situation where the effective ROPs depending on format could be very
    comparable. Also, not a single developer has truly tapped into the
    potential of utilizing the ESRAM as it was intended. Crytech has been to
    confirmed to use some tiling but Ryse was still a launch title. There
    is tons of potential still left.

    http://www.anandtech.com/sh

    http://www.neogaf.com/forum
    http://www.eurogamer.net/ar

    The GPU in the Xbox One will still be slightly weaker, however, the
    added power boost for Devs might get the system to be more comparable to
    the PS4. Development tools are already getting better, and the games
    have definitely improved in terms of graphical fidelity on Xbox One (i.e
    more 900p/1080p). Really, as long as the games look nearly identical do
    these arguments even matter? In terms of power differences this gen the
    games are more like Gamecube vs Xbox graphics, rather than Dreamcast vs
    Nintendo 64, and we all know Gamecube graphics were very comparable to
    Xbox graphics.

    • Michael Norris

      You also need to understand that Ps4 is set up for heavy GpGpu functions,it has a lot more ACE’s.Both console will only improve but,Xone still has only 32mb of Esram,which hurts the system as a whole.Tiled rendering will fix that,but I don’t see 3rd party games going that route.

    • jent

      3rd party games will have to go the Tiled rendering route on both the PS4 and Xbox One eventually. They will be required to by the advancing nature of the games going forward.

    • jent

      BTW the links are incomplete.

    • Illusive Man

      fixed

  • Guest

    http://gamingbolt.com/project-cars-uses-xbox-one-esram-for-deferred-render-targets-careful-use-mitigates-ps4s-unified-memory-advantage

    “Our engine uses a light pre-pass style rendering approach and after
    experimenting with a number of different variations we found it was more
    efficient to use eSRAM to hold the deferred render targets. Careful use
    of eSRAM like this for the various render stages mitigates some of the
    advantage that PS4 has with its faster unified GDDR5 memory,” he said to
    GamingBolt.

    According to Project Cars developers, PS4 has “faster unified GDDR5 memory” in real world game scenarios.

  • Yo Mama
    • Michael Norris

      Indeed =)

    • jent

      Dramatic oversimplification. You know that is true even if you support the idea that the PS4 is more powerful.

    • Illusive Man

      This is much more accurate.

      http://i.imgur.com/366fGpf.png

    • Yo Mama

      And yet Xbox One games still look worse and are outperformed by PS4. Lol. But whatever you have to tell yourself to sleep at night.

    • Illusive Man

      Define worse.

      Do you mean Dreamcast vs N64 graphics worse?

      PSOne vs NES graphics worse?

      No the difference is a lot like the last gen Xbox 360 vs PS3 graphics or if you want to go back further Xbox vs GC graphics.

      You are exaggerating.

      Games, especially newer ones look virtually identical.

    • Jecht_Sin

      Something like 1080p 30fps locked vs sub HD 30 fps with stuttering and screen tearing worse.

    • Yo Mama

      Last gen, both the 360 and PS3 had the same frame rates and resolutions for multiplats. Developers are struggling to get Xbone games to 900p and over 30fps. Where as PS4 games regularly push 60fps and 1080p. So no, there’s a far greater difference this gen.

    • Daniel Lawson

      Developers struggled for years on PS3 and did even towards the end

    • Yo Mama

      They struggled on PS3 because of the cell processor and yet they were always able to match the 360 in terms of fps and resolution. The Xbone can’t say the same.

    • Edonus

      Actually last gen the 360 had better resolutions and frame rates than the Ps3.

      Also Ps4 doesnt regularly have games reach 1080p 60p. And the X1 has games that do reach 1080p. And all of the games are 1080p. We never see an image in our games that isnt 2073600 pixels. The thing is just how the pixels get there. That why the difference is really really small.

      Not to mention lots of games coming up are the same for both. That whole resolution thing is just some more bad journalism that the internet has perpetuated over the last 6-7 months.

    • MrSec84 .

      Since when was it confirmed that PS4’s CPU can only access 20GB/s of RAM bandwidth?

      Mark Cerny only ever said that there’s 20GB/s of direct bandwidth between CPU & GPU, as in on the chip.
      PS4’s APU has a single memory controller, that allows 176GB/s of bandwidth from APU to GDDR5.
      So both CPU & GPU should be able to access the RAM pool at the same speed.

    • async2013

      All the huff and puff from Microsoft geeks yet..

    • Daniel Lawson

      ESRAM reads and writes… to both the CPU/GPU and the actual memory… while that happens the memory reads and writes to the CPU/GPU and the ESRAM that’s reading or writing to the CPU/GPU or Memory

  • Guest

    So is that why they got their game to run at 1080p on the PS4 but only 900p? And the PS3 has a split memory architecture, yet all i heard was fanboy whine about how much better than 360s unified memory architecture was. These guys can say all they want but the games do the talking and in this case, the PS4 has a 44% higher res and i bet you a steadier framerate and probably other effects and features that are better. You fanboys are trying and hoping way to hard to find something to help you feel better about the fact that the X1 is just inferior.

  • No one is doubting the PS4 has stronger hardware. The PS3 had a stronger processor also, but in the end it was the software sales that defined the generation and in that regard, I give more credit to MS than to Sony. Plus I was simply saying that the XB1 can perform better than what has been demonstrated thus far. 1080p is an important benchmark for this generation no doubt, and I think as the next years games and exclusives reveal themselves we’ll see plenty of 1080p games on the XB1 to dispel this belief that the XB1 can’t create high-resolution games…

  • xBox still rules …

    “The Truth About The Coming Zombie Apocalypse”
    http://www.rakuten.com/prod//264888406.html

  • slasaru

    I wonder why they all were silent when MS was contacting them for advice on next gen console during development phase, eh?

  • Dirkster_Dude

    People will take whatever they want from the article and then on top of that make assumptions based on assumptions. Here is what I got from the whole argument: The PS4 50% raw performance over XB1 only makes games easier to code for because you have slightly more to work with, but it isn’t really a game changer compared to the XB1 because both systems have strengths that developers can code for. The XB1 eSRAM may be a benefit in the future once people learn how to take advantage of it. At the same time both systems will be improving the development kits, and introducing other new software technologies to demonstrate console greatness. With all that said Microsoft’s sales problems come more from it’s idiotic launch policies than having a less powerful console that used to cost $100 more than it’s closest competition. Although that doesn’t help.

  • Guest

    “What about Sony paying the press to bullshit the consumers into
    believing the PS4 is 10x more powerful ?”

    PS4 is 10x more powerful than PS3. You have no clue what you’re talking about.

  • Guest

    No, sorry.

    PS4 is more powerful for gaming graphics performance and has far more 1080p native games.

  • Yep, but it’s important to disprove more than half of what he’s saying.


 

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