Low Level APIs On PS4 & Xbox One Will Suffer From Diversity On PC – Dev

Focus Home Interactive’s Sylvain Séchi on the impact of new APIs on video games.

Posted By | On 05th, Jul. 2015 Under News | Follow This Author @GamingBoltTweet


GamingBolt recently caught up with Focus Home Interactive’s Sylvain Séchi to talk about the publisher’s upcoming Blood Bowl 2. During our conversation, GamingBolt was able to ask about upcoming APIs on PC and consoles. Vulkan and DirectX 12 are expected to change things radically in the PC space. Will this mean that gaming PCs will finally catch up with innovations in the console space and can PC sustain more than one API?

“The graphics API panel is certainly evolving at a very quick pace these last few years, and it’s going to keep evolving quickly (DirectX12 iterations, Vulcan,..),” says Sylvain. However Sylvain believes that this diversity on the PC gaming side of things might affect consoles and it will depend from developer to developer on how they write their code. “However, the PC hardware is still very different from the consoles as it’s much more diverse. Therefore, low level APIs like those available on consoles will still suffer from this diversity and optimization will depend on how specific the code will be.”

Sylvain has a point since the APIs on consoles already have the ability to allow programmers to code close to the metal. Vulkan and DirectX 12 will bring in big changes for PC games development scene but the console scene will probably remain unaffected.


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  • Psionicinversion

    how will affect the consoles? they already get 2x longer optimisation over PC. Besides DX12 can still handle some stuff for the dev if they dont want to specifically code for it. Added to the fact he talks about consoles… PS4 will never use Vulkan… ever so nothing is changed there. It will change X1 for the better because it adds stuff lierally not present in any dx11. Can see how games come out running like crap when devs havnt got a clue themselves

    • Guest

      So what is this “stuff” not present in DX11? And why did the devs in the article say “consoles” as in plural as in PS4 and X1, why didn’t he say the PS4 will struggle because of it. I see every x bot in here making up their own sh’t and then getting all bent out of shape when one guys says otherwise. I was told by you fanboys that the X1 was going to be so impressive after all the API,SDK, eSRAM upgrades, yet this guys games is still coming out at 900p vs 1080p on PS4, Batman is 900p and a bunch of new games are ll still 900p on the X1.

    • Lennox

      Going from 900p to 1080p isn’t that impressive. So if DX12 does a better job at getting games to 1080p, how is this all of sudden a big jump. You guys overestimate how much power it takes to get from 900p to 1080p.

    • Fweds

      So “Guest” why not mention FPS or is that a sore area for you ?, PS4 The Witcher 19 FPS – 23 FPS , no good having a higher resolution if the frame rates make the gameplay and visuals worse.
      1st party games like Driveclub stuck at a jerky 30fps despite being just a closed circuit Arcade racer, remember before it’s release you and the other fan boys would say “Yes but racers are easy to do 1080p and 60 fps” but nope PS4 CPU will not allow it.
      I was playing Driveclub and I noticed that despite puddles that looked like rivers when you went through one the was no splash or even any spay just nothing and still only 30 FPS.
      Now look at Forza 6 recorded “live feeds” on YouTube to see how 1080p and 60 fps should be done.

    • Knowles2

      An did Forza 6 have puddles that splash and a weather system to rival Driveclub?.

    • Starman

      yes …. you better look again son…

    • Fweds

      Yes it does and its not released until September, the weather system is better and it has 3d puddles in exactly the same places they gather in real life tracks and they don’t just splash and spray the cars also act as they would in real life when you go through one.

      https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=m8q6aAoRZzM

  • utack

    “innovations in the console space”
    could name one maybe?
    Low level api’s were on PC long before DirectX and OpenGL were invented, they are not the innovation of any console.

  • Gamez Rule

    All ifs and buts with some added maybes thrown in☺

  • XbotMK1

    There is a lot of missinformation in this article. PC has allways held consoles back because PC uses garbage APIs like Direct X. This isn’t anything new and probably won’t change.

    But once again Gamingbolt is spreading missinformation. Sylvain is simply saying that PC will still be holding back low level console APIs but the developer never stated that consoles won’t benefit at all from low level PC APIs like Vulkan. Low level console APIs aren’t used by 3rd parties because PC APIs are the weak link. But if developers start using Vulkan, it will change the way games are made. This will effect 3rd party games on consoles in a positive way because PC won’t be holding back consoles “AS MUCH”. A perfect example would be Driveclub weather physics. I think this will change the way indie devs make games on consoles and PC.

    Consoles set the base for more most video games. When you have variations of hardware it each platform, it makes it hard to maximize the performance of each platform. This is why the PS3 wasn’t fully utilized by 3rd party devs.

    • JerkDaNERD7

      No need for an article buddy everything you hint at is simple. Everything related to Microsoft is bad and everything even in the slightest related to Sony is God like. I don’t even understand why you try, you’re a joke.

    • DLConspiracy//

      Yeah.. I have seen him in other articles doing this. This particular article is weird though.

    • Guest

      Shut up nerd, you don’t even make sense. And you’re weird all the time.

    • DLConspiracy//

      OK. Guest. I would tell you about yourself but unfortunately you are too chickensh*t to have a name. 😉

    • Guest

      And you’re still not making any sense cuz my name is Guest, if you don’t like that then sorry, deal with it. But that’s my name fool.

    • DLConspiracy//

      And I’m the weird one.

    • Fweds

      He clearly searches for Xbox news I see him on every Xbox site I visit trying to spread negativity.

      Quite sad really.

    • Guest

      Funny because I didn’t get that impression at all! However I do see that you are a over sensitive, defensive little fanboy. Have fun whining some more. Waaahhhhh!!!! You’re the joke, you rat!

    • Fweds

      AHH now you called him “RAT” you have made that mistake before when using your multis haven’t you……….

    • SaberEdge

      That’s some crazy delusion you have there.

    • efnet

      Stop acting like you know anything about coding lol you probably stock shelves at a local grocery store lol……

    • There are TONS of kids that I grew up with on the PC who “stocked shelves at a grocery store” but could outcode me any day until I learned more. Just because somebody doesn’t work in a PC-related job does NOT mean they can’t code or build a serious website or w/e. I’d watch it man..

    • efnet

      I don’t need to …xbotx1 can’t do neither so I’m not to worried about that but for thoes who are familiar won’t act like he or she does and that’s a fact ….data warehouse manager here with a master’s in computer science and if you haven’t noticed my name EFNET which is my second home on irc where I got my first taste in coding, hacking, the scene ect.ect. back in 56k dail up days …when you have abilities and or talents you tend to show more respect to thoes who have similar talents …you get what im saying

    • Mark

      I don’t know why people like to defend a rabid fanboy, from either side. Xbot1 is clearly that. But imo, those type of dudes maybe doing their job…..in reality there really are shills getting paid for such a thing. If Xbot1 isn’t making a penny from this tho, he’a missing out lol.

    • shane

      Okay, just like MS has billions of dollars while Sony is broke,almost bankrupt and their stock has been downgraded to junk status by major credit breaules.

    • Mark

      Clearly that’s the problem with my statement, the “Sony paying shills” theory. I hear u, it’s just I don’t have any other explanation why these guys r like this…..

    • Guest

      Why didn’t you say that to all the other x bots commenting? Cuz all those idiots are saying the complete opposite of what the dev is saying in the article. He is saying “consoles” *as n=both consoles) will suffer from it, Yet all the fanboys are claiming otherwise. When he’s a dev and you people are just fanboys.

    • efnet

      I comment to the moron who says the same exact thing on 30+ websites ……the guy is a complete fool

    • shane

      Your just mad because you got suckerd into whole greatness awaits thing.

    • Starman

      where do you come up with this crap son ????

  • JerkDaNERD7

    Actually XOne no doubt will be a huge benefactor in this since DirectX 12 will be closely related to PC development.

    • AndroidVageta

      That’s not really true at all. In fact, the architecture that the X1’s GPU is built off of isn’t even compatible with DX12 according to AMD. So you better hope that the modifications MS did to it were enough to change that.

      Either way, it already has low level access so it’s not going to change anything that much. Just the nature of the beast.

    • AndrewLB

      The comparison between Xbox One’s GPU and Bonaire was speculation based on core count. Nothing more.

      Xbone is DirectX 12.0 feature set compatible, not 12.1. Additionally, all cards that are DX11 or DX11.1 are at a minimum DX12.0 compliant.

    • Mark

      Got a link for that? I surmise ur speculating, albeit reasonable. Otherwise the proof’s on u.

    • JerkDaNERD7

      You have no source for that, so sorry that’s pure speculation. If anything DirectX 12 was already designed for XOne it just wasn’t named DirectX 12 yet.

    • Mark

      I think he’s referring to off shelf AMD cards…

    • Starman

      like the one , sony uses …

    • shane

      What are you talking about, XB1 already uses direct X 11.1.

    • Guest

      Is that why the dev say both? Cuz he would know better than your fanboy assuming behind.

    • JerkDaNERD7

      The creator of Farm simulator who hasn’t even touched an Xbox One and DirectX 12? ….This is speculative article.

    • Fweds

      Now who have we got here ?.
      Has XbotMK1 changed over to another user name, very likely.
      OR it (or he ) could be “Derp”, Something “Ocelot”, “Xrat” or one of about 4 other user names, but it’s one of those fan boys as the way he writes is exactly the same.

      At least he seems to of stopped using the upvote bot now days but I suppose that become a bit to obvious and was just weird.

    • Starman

      don’t forget “theadjustmentbuearu”

    • Gamez Rule

      I wouldn’t say *huge* but benefactor nevertheless.

    • JerkDaNERD7

      I would say huge benefactor in comparison to where it’s at now with it’s API. Not in terms of pure performance but features and advantages provided.

    • Gamez Rule

      Well you say huge while most devs point out a slight benefactor for Xbone gaming. PC = huge, Xbone not so much.

    • Knowles2

      PS4 got it own low level APIs which developers can already use.

  • Ricoh123

    Under the windows 10 platform, PC gaming and Xbox one gaming will complement each other nicely. The PC will have the graphics, the Xbox one will have the value for money.

    The ps4 will be the machine to suffer as long as Microsoft keep control of the PC operating system.

    Expect ps4 development to be problematic for third party titles, giving the edge to Microsoft in terms of third party priorities.

    • Guest

      Blah, blah, blah, more fanboy drivel and “blah”. Yup that’s why he said both right? Cuz he doesn’t know what he’s talking about, I mean he’s only made a game for both systems already but you do. You fanboys try to hard, armchair devs.

    • Gamez Rule

      “The ps4 will be the machine” Why?

      How can PS4 suffer due to MS having control of the PC operating system?

    • Ricoh123

      Because dx12 unifies the xb1 and PC. Development between the two is made easy for devs to port very fast.

      The ps4 needs specialised conversions which costs time and money.

      The PC + XB1 customer base absolutely dwarves the ps4 customer base.

      This means devs may not bother porting to the ps4, or if they do, it’s likely to be an inferior port since developing for PC and xb1 will become the priority.

    • Gamez Rule

      And this is all based on your ideas I take it.

      Do you really think that PS4 games will suffer due to DX12? Hasn’t the PS4 already got a low level API than what DX12 could do in Xbone? And how do you know that PC / Xbone will be priority?

    • Ricoh123

      It’s reasonable to suggest that devs will prioritise most resources to the largest customer base.

    • Gamez Rule

      And it hasn’t been the case before has it? Look back at PS3 / 360 / PS2 / XBOX, so nothing will change this gen IMO as otherwise everything that doesn’t use DX12 will suffer ( phones / tablets / consoles / TVs ) ect.

    • Ricoh123

      False.

      The Wii and Wii u struggled to adopt third party games and as a result relies on games specialised for Nintendo.

      If MS successfully gain market share by integrating dx12 devices, the ps4 will not be used to maximum potential.

      Exactly like what happened with ps3.

    • Gamez Rule

      Always been the case with Nintendo. Same as Sega too. That’s nothing new.

      PS3 was used to maximum potential by some devs and even made games better than 360 version ( 3rd party ) but to think that “IF MS successfully gain market share by integrating dx12 devices, the ps4 will not be used to maximum potential” is just false as there is a too big a market to allow that to take place, that’s the main point.

      PS3 and the PS4 globally outsells Microsofts systems that it competes against. Yet most guys refuses to face this reality.

      Has a MS home console ever outsold a Sony home console? …… Nope. And I can’t see Xbone changing this Sony streak with DX12. Time will tell

    • Mark

      Ever heard of Asynchronous Compute? EA used it in BF 4, and so did Sucker Punch with Infamous (first party I know). It’s a low level API feature…….in fact, Ian Bell from Slightly Mad said P Cars is using 95-99% of the PS4’s resources…..

      So, SOME 3rd partie studios are using the PS4’s low level GNMI wrapper, otherwise they couldn’t possibly squeeze that much percentage of perf outta it..that’s the point of having access to “low level” of the hardware.

    • Gamez Rule

      DICE simply didn’t have the time to make anywhere near a full implementation of Mantle’s capabilities yet Battlefield4 is already using the AC features on PS4, this is correct but it’s still cross platform hence why I stated that “3rd party devs don’t use it FULLY because that means they wouldn’t be able to port their games to the Xbone”

      And Im lead to believe that IF a game only used DX12 then that game wouldn’t be on anything but a MS platform using DX12 ( leaving most phones / tablets / consoles & PCs ect without that game and in turn losing the devs money IMO.

      Pre-GCN and many nvidia cards do not support async compute shaders as far as i’m aware?

    • Mark

      “3rd party devs don’t use it FULLY”. I have a hard time believing dat. From GBolt article;

      “Regarding the PS4 version, Bell revealed that they are pushing every core of the PS4 to 99%+ under heavy load along with GPU at 95%. Regardless, they will try and keep optimizing the PS4 version”.

      http://gamingbolt.com/project-cars-ps4-using-99-of-cpu-cores-and-95-gpu-new-tracks-wii-u-version-details-and-more

      The whole point of using a low level API, is to push the hardware to its limit, thru tools & features to grant access to cpu, gpu and memory without needing massive code for every command, resulting in usage numbers like 95% and 99%+ threshold. If u notice, many 3rd party studios are optimizing code post launch, shwy we see little bumps in frame rates and overall perf. The PS4 is giving its biggest benefits in SOME multiplats. But not all. As for ur other thoughts on DX12 I hear u, and its ur opinion. I just wanted to mention this tho.

  • Hvd

    did this author ever hear about dx12 for x1 and pc maybe ps4 will suffer.

    • Guest

      Did you even read what it says? The consoles will suffer not a console will suffer for it.

    • Psionicinversion

      they wont suffer at all. there all seapaete

    • Guest

      Right, well then tell him that. Hey Gamingbolt, tell this dev that Psionicinversion said they wont suffer. Quickly, let him know.

    • Psionicinversion

      yeah… got an e-mail the same military. maybe you should run to, thats all

    • Fweds

      Flag his comments, he will then change over to his other multis but his poor writing style is always the same .

    • Hvd

      yes xbox one and pc will have dx12 ps4 will not which means ps4 will suffer more then xbox one. so to keep it SIMPLE for you dx12 pc and xbox one.no dx12 ps4.

    • Knowles2

      Of cause the PS4 got a way bigger market than Xbox one and consoles generally outsell PC games.

    • Mark

      How does “PS4 has a way bigger market” compare to HOW the system’s programmed for, aka its API? Understand, just because a dev chooses to do a PS4 port, that doesn’t necessarily translate to a smooth port from PC, with both platforms not sharing the same language. That’s the topic of discussion here. But look, the PS4 will get great ports, it won’t run like trash just because it doesn’t share that common denominator. The Xbox will get smooth ports too, MAINLY because of DX12 & the PIX tool for the Esram. We’ll all have amazing games comin from PC man. People get oversensitive bout NOTHING.

  • Mark

    Seeing that alot of devs (said to be more than 100 currently per Microsoft) are using DirectX12 on their games, the X1 will see a smooth port from PC. I expect many, many games to run DX12 code in the next year or 2 so the Xbox versions will benefit from that.

    However I see what Sylvain means from a Vulkan perspective. If said developer builds their game with both DX12 & Vulkan, then it’s gonna mean more optimizations not only on PC but consoles too. So that would be 3 total languages the dev would have to know (Vulkan, PS4’s GNMI, & DX12). But whatever, I’m most excited about the games we’re getting and people get waaaay too sensitive about “who’s gonna see the most benefits” and argue over it like they’re in Congress debating a darn bill. PC gamers will see most benefits, while upcoming console games look dam good imo. Win win, well except for last gen tho.

  • justerthought

    Devs need to realise who is paying their wages. Big budget games cannot be financed by the small PC gaming market. They need the consoles to pay for the development. If they start to use programming techniques to take advantage of new PC tech that deteriorates console optimisation, console gamers are just going to refuse the purchase and they won’t get paid for their work.

    The only PC devs that will be able to fully utilise such tech are the small PC developers who make low budget PC games that don’t need financial support from consoles, but even those are rare now because they are all jumping on the PS4 cash cow. Everybody man and his dog wants their game on PS4 because they think that guarantees sales, but if it’s not high quality and fully optimised it just won’t sell. We have standards.

    • Mark

      I hear u there. I do believe Cliffy B is working on a PC exclusive tho, & the screens look graphically sick. Plus Star Citizen won’t suffer.

    • Gamez Rule

      True, Example = The rebuilt-not-ported PS4 version of The Vanishing of Ethan Carter will be released next week, Wednesday 15th July. The rebuilt PC version, which incorporates Unreal Engine 4 and the changes made for PS4, is still “a few weeks away”.

      So although the games on PC ( old version ) the money maker is PS4 in the Devs views, so they release the non-ported version onto PS4 first then over to PC.

  • VoidWalker

    Consoles have ruined gaming . ..

  • Convergence87

    LOL pathetic article. Hows batman running on your pc? runs fine on consoles

  • mushahid

    I can’t say something about PS4 its great for me because during my searching for PS4 i got many blogs about this like http://bestgamesellers.com/ i search that this was best for me PS4 and about xbox its on 2nd number……….!


 

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